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Author Topic: 05 Dyno numbers  (Read 5514 times)

rjh200

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Re: 05 Dyno numbers
« Reply #30 on: March 22, 2005, 03:11:17 PM »
Have you ever compared an R6 or a 636 sprocket to ours.  The things are friggin massive.
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JQrr

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Re: 05 Dyno numbers
« Reply #31 on: March 22, 2005, 03:24:48 PM »
Have you ever compared an R6 or a 636 sprocket to ours.  The things are friggin massive.
The front or rear sprockets?  I'm guessing you're talking about the front cuz I didn't see any big difference between r6 and 636 rear sprokets and cbr's...
You don't know what you don't know until you KNOW what you don't know............  WHAT??

rjh200

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Re: 05 Dyno numbers
« Reply #32 on: March 22, 2005, 03:42:30 PM »
The stock rear sprocket on the 04 R6 looks like a monster when compared side by side with the RR.  Last year at a bike show we had them side by side and the Yami looked like it was about 4 or 5 teeth larger in the rear.
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Jeff

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Re: 05 Dyno numbers
« Reply #33 on: March 22, 2005, 03:45:31 PM »
Ever seen the transmissions side-by-side?  No?  You can't compare sprockets on 2 different manufacturers and 2 different bikes without understanding the transmission ratios  :)
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rjh200

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Re: 05 Dyno numbers
« Reply #34 on: March 22, 2005, 03:51:06 PM »
I just looked it up.  The Yami comes stock with a 16/48, The Kawi comes with a 15/40 and as we all know the honda has a 16/43 set-up.  

I am looking up the Transmition Ratios now, so relax there Jeffy.  I knew somebody was gonna snap back with that.
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madmanu

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Re: 05 Dyno numbers
« Reply #35 on: March 22, 2005, 03:54:16 PM »
The Kawi comes with a 15/40

Waiting on the gear ratio  :pop: it sure looks like a wheelie monster just with that sprocket set, can you include the gixxer as well?

rjh200

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Re: 05 Dyno numbers
« Reply #36 on: March 22, 2005, 04:07:18 PM »
Yamaha
Primary Reduction Ratio
 86/44 (1.955)
 
Secondary Reduction Ratio
 48/16 (3.000)
 
Gear Ratio - 1st Gear
 37/13 (2.846)
 
Gear Ratio - 2nd Gear
 28/18 (1.556)
 
Gear Ratio - 3rd Gear
 28/18 (1.556)
 
Gear Ratio - 4th Gear
 32/24 (1.333)
 
Gear Ratio - 5th Gear
 25/21 (1.190)
 
Gear Ratio - 6th Gear
 26/24 (1.083)
 
I will try to find the GSXR gear ratios.
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rjh200

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Re: 05 Dyno numbers
« Reply #37 on: March 22, 2005, 04:23:21 PM »
Honda Ratios
Primary Reduction
 2.111 (76/36)
 
Gear Ratios     1st
 2.666 (32/12)
 
 2nd
 1.937 (31/16)
 
 3rd
 1.661 (29/18)
 
 4th
 1.409 (31/22)
 
 5th
 1.285 (27/21)
 
 6th
 1.166 (28/24)
 
Final Reduction
 2.625 (42/16)
 
Kawisaki Ratios

Primary reduction ratio:
2.022 (89/44)
Gear Ratios:
1st
2.923 (38/13)
2nd
2.055 (37/18)
3rd
1.722 (31/18)
4th
1.450 (29/20)
5th
1.272 (28/22)
6th
1.153 (30/26)
Final reduction ratio:
2.666 (40/15)


Suzuki Ratios

Primary Drive Gear Teeth (Ratio)  41/ 79 (1.926:1)
 Final Drive Sprocket Teeth (Ratio)  16/ 45 (2.812:1)
 Transmission Gear Teeth (Ratios) 

 6th   25/ 23 (1.086:1)

 5th  29/ 24 (1.208:1)

 4th  30/ 22 (1.450:1)

 3rd  32/ 20 (1.682:1)

 2nd  32/ 16 (2.053:1)

 1st  39/ 14 (2.786:1)
 Transmission Overall Ratios 

 6th  5.890:1

 5th   6.548:1

 4th  7.389:1

 3rd  8.670:1

 2nd  10.832:1

 1st 15.083:1
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madmanu

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Re: 05 Dyno numbers
« Reply #38 on: March 22, 2005, 04:43:59 PM »
My gear-ratio tank is really dry, please explain the difference  8)

rjh200

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Re: 05 Dyno numbers
« Reply #39 on: March 23, 2005, 10:19:25 AM »
My gear-ratio tank is really dry, please explain the difference  8)

While I do have some understanding of the gear ratios, I will let somebody that can explain it better take this one. 
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TopgunRR

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Re: 05 Dyno numbers
« Reply #40 on: March 23, 2005, 11:51:10 AM »
My gear-ratio tank is really dry, please explain the difference  8)
I'll give it a shot. I don't know exactly what you want to know...

note that each transmission has a primary and final reduction in addition to whichever gear is engaged. the engine's power is transmitted through each reduction ratio (primary, selected gear, final) until it reaches the rear wheel.

the numbers that look like this (31/22) are the number of teeth on each of the two meshing gears. to get the gear ratio for that set, simply divide them: 31/22 = 1.409

nomenclature: two gears permanently meshed are called a gearset. the bigger is called the gear, and the smaller is called the pinion.

the ratio is the number of turns the pinion makes for every one turn of the gear. for example, 1.409:1 means the pinion turns 1.409 times for every one turn of the gear.

notice that the ratios get progressively smaller as you go up through the gearbox. that makes sense, since you go faster as you go up through the gears. each gear reduces the engine's rpms less.

so, to compare each manufacturer, you should find the final transmission ratio for each gear. suzuki has already done this (trans. overall ratios). to get those numbers, simply multiply the primary reduction, final reduction, and gear ratio. for example, the first gear overall ratio:
             
             primary x final x 1st = overall
             suzuki
             1.926 x 2.812 x 2.786 = 15.08
             honda
             2.111 x 2.625 x 2.666 = 14.77
             kawasaki
             2.022 x 2.666 x 2.923 = 15.75

now that we have overall ratios, we can say (in first gear) the suzuki engine turns over 15.08 times to turn the rear wheel once, the honda 14.77 times, etc.

in first gear, kawasaki has the highest reduction ratio, or the "lowest" first gear. conclusion? a kawasaki has a slight mechanical advantage in first gear.

simple mathematics.

ps - if you really wanted to, you could calculate how fast the bike would be going at a given rpm in a given gear using these numbers:

            rwheel rpm = rpm / overall ratio
            rwheel circuference = 2( 3.14 )( rwheel radius in inches )
            speed in inches per minute = rwheel rpm( rwheel circumference )
            now just convert inches per minute to miles per hour.
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madmanu

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Re: 05 Dyno numbers
« Reply #41 on: March 23, 2005, 12:00:01 PM »
If Kawasaki engine needs to make more turns to rotate the wheel once, why would that be a mechanical advantage?  :( please explain a bit.

TopgunRR

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Re: 05 Dyno numbers
« Reply #42 on: March 23, 2005, 12:31:41 PM »
If Kawasaki engine needs to make more turns to rotate the wheel once, why would that be a mechanical advantage?  :( please explain a bit.
remember your ten speed bicycle? ride a bike around to get an intuitive feeling for gear ratios. low gear = lots of pedaling for low speed, high gear = little pedaling for high speed. lower gears are easier to pedal in, right? you (the engine) has a greater mechanical advantage in a lower gear. the obvious trade-off is speed. you can't go as fast as someone in a higher gear, but you will accelerate faster.

it's the same for motorcycles. the kawi gets more piston strokes in (more power) to turn the rear wheel once than the honda. if the kawi is going 10 mph, it's engine is running at a higher rpm than the honda going 10 mph. and since engines develop more horsepower with more rpms, the kawi would have more power at that speed.

try this: race someone on your bike, but you start out in 2nd gear, and have them start in first. you'd get off to a much slower start, right? the kawi having a "lower" first gear than the honda is exactly like this, only not so exaggerated.

That the kawi needs more turns to rotate the wheel once is the *definition* of mechanical advantage.
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madmanu

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Re: 05 Dyno numbers
« Reply #43 on: March 23, 2005, 12:37:41 PM »
I was thinking the opposite, less turn less engine stress (input torgue) better mechanical advantage. Thanks for the informative breakdown  :thumb:

TopgunRR

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Re: 05 Dyno numbers
« Reply #44 on: March 23, 2005, 12:42:28 PM »
Glad to help... I'm just glad I'm finally using my education!  :P
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